Plasma Pod, Eternity Device, and more of those.

[Commx]

My question is simple really, where are they?

Although they do appear in the list of all ships, they aren't in the Tech-trees, nor mentioned anywhere else in the manual. Are they still to be implemented, once implemented but removed again, hidden somewhere, or something else?

[The Flying Ace]

Go to your base screen (HQ), and on the bottom you will see a link with "Ships on Planets".

Not every player invented ship can be implemented into the game, so some ships are put onto planets, which can suppliment your fleets.

Before you go to these planets to pick up some ships, be sure to leave some free manpower. Even though you dont have to actually build them, you have to staff them.

[Commx]

Hmm, I thought that button brought me to my own fleet, serves me right for not trying.

But does this mean that those ships can only be used there and then, or can I 'simply' go there, man some, then take it back to my own planet?

[Metody I The Evil]

You pick 'em up and do with 'em as you do with all other ships
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"Unity creates power"
Khan Kubrat to his 5 sons

[Commx]

Ok, now the fleet is out to get some, thanks a lot both of you.

[T2]

Don't forget to use the archeology probe. Much to my plesant surprise, there is ships all over the place on most if not all pre-warp planets. Not just the one's listed in the H.Q. screen.
Check it out ! Just go out with a mother and collect to your hearts content.
I found the ships at the "ship planets" are not really suited for stand-alone battle but they can suppliment a "normal" fleet with a few surprises.
Happy Hunting
T2

[Commx]

Really? Then that expedition will be my next research.

For now the ones that show up are enough though, all I am after for now is a Plasma Pod to try the following:

1 Fighter
1 Cruiser
1 Plasma Pod
1 Doomstar
1 Major R.
1 Mothership

If it proves not to work, I'll go try something like collecting a few hundred Eternity Devices or some other ridiculous thing using 'ancient' tech

[Swankbusters]

Dont try it, or, what exactly are you trying?

[Commx]

What I'm trying is the following:

Class 1:
Enemy wipes out 1 fighter, score -1
Class 2:
Enemy wipes out 1 Destroyer(my bad, Cruiser should have been Destroyer), score - 9
Class 3:
Enemy does something, Plasma Pod reacts by jamming everything and ending the class. Score -139
Class 4
Doomstar wipes out entire fleet of 3 and lower, Major Reconstructor rebuilds Doomstar and Plasma Pod(50% chance)

Final score: 50% chance of -9 + Enemy fleet, and 50% chance of -2439 + Enemy fleet

[streacer]

While it's good that you're trying to think up fleet combos and combine ships that you think will work well together... never forget that often times the simplest answer is the best one. Use the KISS principle as much as possible.

If you want to use a Doomstar to take out someone's fleet, for practical purposes the best set-up is probably just 1 doomstar with 1 mothership to deliver it.

There is no need for a class 1 block because no class 1 ship is going to kill your doomstar before it gets a chance to explode... except maybe a prophet, which is A) unlikely to be in a fleet, and B) would blow up his whole fleet anyway. Same concept with classes 2 and 3.

Also, your major reconstructor would not rebuild the doomstar (ships that self destruct are not reconstructable.) It might reconstruct the plasma pod if it had been killed by an enemy ship and reduced to exactly 0 lp, but if your Doomstar had blown it up ("obliterated") or the enemy had damaged it to negative hit points, it would not reconstruct either.



Regarding class blocks:

Class 3: Enemy does something, Plasma Pod reacts by jamming everything and ending the class. Score -139

You could also simply use 1 cruiser, which would get killed and end the class battle... for less man power consumed (and points lost). A cluster-cruiser or C-cannon platform would do the same even cheaper... and if you happen to have a nano-virus lying around from a previous battle against a plague ship, you could use it as a c3 block for ZERO manpower.

[Commx]

[streacer]

An evaporator only destroys ships when it gets modified (it was designed as a counter to cyclopses and such ships), so if you had just a mothership and doomstar, you wouldn't trigger it's destructo-beam-of-death. I suppose if they had 2 evaporators and your doomstar went off, the 2nd evaporator might kill your mothership. But regardless, your doomstar would still annihilate their fleet.

Heck, I guess in theory they could trigger their own evaporator with a sporator... but they would have to be incredibly lucky to have a sporator go off before your doomstar fights, and I really wouldn't be worried about a possible fluke like that.

Otherwise, if an evaporator never gets triggered it will simply function as a really expensive 1/2 fighter.

A large group of fighters wouldn't kill a doomstar because each player gets a turn in alternating order. So it would go something like this:

Them: 900 fighters
You: 1 doomstar

Even if they get the initiative and shoot first, 1 fighter attacks your doomstar. Doomstar is reduced to 899 hit points. Now it's your turn, and the doomstar explodes.

They could jam it with an emp fighter and then have 900 fighters kill off the doomstar at their leisure. They could use a mantis. Or most reliably, they could simply have a fleet with less than 2300 manpower and watch your doomstar blow itself up for a big loss. If I suspect you're sending a doomstar my way, I can just create a fleet with 1 fighter and nothing else. Doomstar self destructs and kills the fighter: I win an instant 2299 points.



(but what will I do with the 3 Plasma Pods I just collected...)

I suppose you could set it up as sort of a retreat-fighter/evasor for class 3. There are probably other uses as well although I can't think of any off-hand.

[Commx]

Oh, that's what the modified means in that sentence.(I read it as the enemy's energy being modified, so as a background sentence, not a technical one.)

The Doomstar doesn't sound that attractive any more really, so perhaps its a good thing to think up something else.(Although I suppose the single Fighter tactic could be stopped by adding the single Fighter/Destroyer/Cruiser to the fleet)

How about this:
Class 1: None
Class 2: Pile-O-Eagle
Class 3: 3 Plasma Pod
Class 4: Mothership

The idea is to have the Plasma Pod stop Swank Fleets from wiping out the Eagles(most Swanks have Plasma Gunships, which trigger the Pod, and preventing Apollos and other Gunships from working), while the Eagles just do their usual swarming of the target.

[T2]

It would be nice if an edited version of this thread could be put into the ship descriptions in the manual under the doomstar description and perhaps other ships mentioned.

I understand what Commox means when he said the descriptions can be confusing.
I really like the description for the mosquito

[streacer]

Yes, adding a fighter/destroyer/cruiser would save you, in the sense that it would force a fighter vs fighter confrontation and then the battle would end before your doomstar ever did anything. But that also makes your doomstar rather useless... or they could just use a 1/1/1/1 fleet to ensure your doomstar goes off.

Doomstars are only good against really massive fleets, and generally speaking there are better ways to destroy a fleet without sacrificing 2300 points. I would consider a doomstar to be more of a surprise weapon than a true threat. For example if you had nanite tech or use the archeology expedition to find ships, you might get away with throwing a bunch of jammers into a fleet with a doomstar and mothership. It would show up on a DSP as a 0/0/40/2 fleet -- a dead giveaway for either swank or anti-swank. Then if you get lucky, some poor sap will attack you with 4000 fighters trying to kill off your "obvious" fleet of plasma gunships, and your doomstar wins you 1540 points.

Some situation like that might lead to a fun booby-trapped fleet, but within the context of traditional battle, doomstars are not terribly efficient scoring machines since you have to make 2300 points just to break even.


Regarding your eagle/plasma pod fleet. I think it could probably work (assuming the plasma gunship's "kill" command falls under trigger_hit, of which I am not sure). But I generally fight swank fleets with anti-swank plasma fleets, or just try to avoid a losing battle... no sense fighting a swank fleet with an eagle fleet in the first place.



Incidentally I just realized that evaporators have trigger_plus and trigger_destroy, but not trigger_obliterate... so (going back to the earlier example) the evaporators would not be triggered and your mothership would in fact survive.

[Commx]

No it's definetely not something advisable, but I doubt I'll get to pick what I fight against when and where, so the idea was to have a fleet that would have a chance against most builds, not just the low levels like most Eagle Fleets are after. And most importantly I'm trying to think up something that is a bit original, as to not fall in the "Oh, another one of those."-category.

(The whole point in using the Doomstar wasn't really its effectiveness to begin with, I think a Spectre together with some Plasma Gunships will be a lot better at this.)

Nice idea about the Jammers, perhaps thye're worth picking up somewhere and trying it once for a laugh.

Any other important things I should think of when constructing fleets, or whenever?