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CTF pact
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Senor
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 Post Posted: Sat Jan 17, 2009 2:49 am    Post subject: CTF pact
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as we all know, there's some hot discussion about ctf and its loopholes right now. there are ways an alliance can use to keep their flag from not being stolen (drop-2 method).
it also seems that most if not all forum members agree that this loophole is bad for the overall balance of the game.
so, until admins program the loopholes out of the game, i propose a pact that all alliance leaders sign by posting in this thread.
by signing this pact you agree and promise that your alliance shall not use these dirty tactics (dropping to 2 members to avoid flag loss) until they are repaired by the admins.

please sign.
senor.

..............................................................................................
ALLIANCES THAT HAVE SIGNED THIS PACT

Examine Your Zipper
The Order of Chaos
NoStars
Psylociboids
RedDwarf
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Last edited by Senor on Sat Jan 17, 2009 3:36 pm; edited 2 times in total
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Senor
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 Post Posted: Sat Jan 17, 2009 2:51 am    Post subject:
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I agree to not to use this tactic.

senor, leader of Examine Your Zipper.
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Failtrip1
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 Post Posted: Sat Jan 17, 2009 3:04 am    Post subject:
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ToC agrees and gives its signature to it
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Jack09
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 Post Posted: Sat Jan 17, 2009 3:28 am    Post subject:
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Ok my Freaking alliance thing keeps saying may not contain ' or ', but when i get a new alliance:

I Tranifige of Itronani Zeta, promises not to use the flag tactic.
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DragonLilly
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 Post Posted: Sat Jan 17, 2009 4:32 am    Post subject: Re: CTF pact
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SELF EDIT :: See my post below

Last edited by DragonLilly on Sat Jan 17, 2009 6:03 am; edited 1 time in total
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Jack09
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 Post Posted: Sat Jan 17, 2009 4:44 am    Post subject:
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Jeez DL, can you just agree to this post, Senor wants everyone to play fair and dont do DIRTY TACTICS for the good of the game, but you have to criticize this post.

Please for the good of the game, agree to this and dont use anymore Dirty Tactics, this may be a war game, but its not a real war, its a GAME, therefore there are rules and regulations, and although the ADMIN hasn't posted rules for these, i think everyone would agree that to not do these dirty tactics would make the game more challenging and more fun for everyone.
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Breon
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 Post Posted: Sat Jan 17, 2009 4:56 am    Post subject: Flag Capture
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This particular member has no interest in playing the capture the flag game. I know some other members in CGC feel the same. I understand some may view this as a dirty tactic but we do what we have to do to play with in current rules. Since our alliance is really active and our alliance score will shoot through the roof again. We just dont wanna mess with playing the flag game. Simply put we wanna hunt
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Jack09
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 Post Posted: Sat Jan 17, 2009 5:05 am    Post subject: Re: Flag Capture
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Breon wrote:
This particular member has no interest in playing the capture the flag game. I know some other members in CGC feel the same. I understand some may view this as a dirty tactic but we do what we have to do to play with in current rules. Since our alliance is really active and our alliance score will shoot through the roof again. We just dont wanna mess with playing the flag game. Simply put we wanna hunt


But other players dont like this, dont criticize someone elses topic, as i stated before, just because the rules arnt posted doesnt mean we should use these tactics, they are cowardess and stupid. if no one uses these this game will be more challenging and bring an extra element to the game, and if your just going to criticize someones topic, dont bother even posting here.
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Breon
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 Post Posted: Sat Jan 17, 2009 5:12 am    Post subject: Re flag capture
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I wasn't criticizing this thread. I was stating my opinion Jacko. I'm still entitled to opinion aren't I ?
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DragonLilly
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 Post Posted: Sat Jan 17, 2009 5:19 am    Post subject:
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@ all -- its obvious how much everyone likes CTF... unfortunately the CGC doesn't feel this way... especially with a group of very close friends who are really active which causes our member score to shoot through the roof and automatically making us a target for flag capture... We don't want to play CTF... we have no intentions next era of taking any flags... even if we get into war with someone... so therefore I think that other alliances should just leave our flag alone... and the suggestion if you don't want to play CTF and going with a 2 man alliance or less... thats NOT going to happen as we have 4 players/people/friends that want to play in the same alliance...

we just want to 'hunt' for our points... CTF is not worth our time due to our activity levels and the use of the other dirty tactics by other alliances... why should we agree to this if other 'dirty' tactics are going to be used against us?

EDIT::: To keep the air clear - this post is not argumentative by any means at all... it's mere discussion...
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SpaceGamer
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 Post Posted: Sat Jan 17, 2009 6:04 am    Post subject:
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Failtrip1 wrote:
ToC agrees and gives its signature to it


So Toc you have agreed to not drop members until they evo out by destruction of IT.


I agree to follow the Spacetrace Rules.

At this time there is no rule that states you can not ban any member at anytime. It your flag was in jeopardy because a spy or two you would definitely want to be able to ban them.
I don't see how admin could enforce that banning rule.

I have to Agree with DragonLilly that I hate the flag capture game. I will still allow myself to be banned whenever needed. The flag capture game should be a choice like Score planets or the creature game or colony expansion. So all you out there who want our flag because you are too lazy to fight to make points I say so what.
Attack for real points. Win them.
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Durago
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 Post Posted: Sat Jan 17, 2009 6:10 am    Post subject:
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the psd agrees to it. but how does that even it up if one alliance still feels they are above any rules. i say that something more needs to be done.


i say we need a tribunal of nonpartisan judges to decide what to do about the "bug abuse" used by the cgc. they obviously knew they had found a bug and abused to to the point where we are all saying the game needs to be rewritten, and they acted like they were doing nothing wrong and trying to get the CFT removed so they could cover up what they were doing.


as stated many times before " CTF IS OPTIONAL, I REPEAT, CTF IS OPTIONAL, DO NOT EVER HAVE MORE THAN 2 MEMBERS IN YOUR ALLIANCE AND YOU DON'T HAVE A FLAG TO GUARD"

when i started playing ST, i didnt want to do any battles, i just wanted to explore the universe, colonize planets and name unknown ones. but my base was too close to a few good players that liked to battle. i didn't cry and say the war part of the game should be removed or optional, because i just want to explore. when my alliance got in it's first war and got it's flag stolen, i didnt even know there was a flag that needed to be guarded, we sucked it up and played the war.

if there were no flag to guard or to steal, what good is a war?
how can it be a war if you are not fighting for a prize?
war is not about points, war is about ruling the enemy. if we invade another country, the first thing we do is "capture the flag" and remove it from that country, and put up our own.

edit--- just say this when i logged into st on the irc---
these are the messages during the last 30 Min.:
[06:14] Lilly: ...
[06:15] Lilly: Jov - you didn't need to agree to the CTF pact... noone wants your flag... it ain't worth crap...

again i will tell you, grow up
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Marth Diro
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 Post Posted: Sat Jan 17, 2009 11:00 am    Post subject:
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NS agrees to use no abusing drop-to-2 tactic!

it's annoying to see CGC members still insisting to ab-use this bug. lilly, your ally is the only one, which doesn't want to play the whole game! you can't eat as much you can (getting points from other payers), without going to the toilet (guarding your flag).

CGC, please conform to this topic, since all other players are standing behind this idea. and it's nothing against CGC, it's for the fun and spirit of the game!

this bug will be fixed, but not clear how and when. do not exploit the situation that the admin needs some more time to fix it!
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drill sergeant
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 Post Posted: Sat Jan 17, 2009 12:59 pm    Post subject:
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I will not sign this pact. This pact is to only rule out the tactic of dropping to two members, a tactic used by a defending alliance. I will only consider signing this if all dirty tactics are ruled out. I have a trainings alliance. The worst case scenario for me is to have to try and capture my flag back from an alliance that can have a member or two evo'ing out to keep it from being stolen. You can't rule out 1 dirty tactic and leave the other one out there.
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Senor
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 Post Posted: Sat Jan 17, 2009 2:39 pm    Post subject:
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so, XYZ, TOC and NS have signed.
edit>i missed PSD, thanks for signing Durago

WFS? n00b H4X0rz? TPC? what do you say?

CGC, you CANT CHOOSE what part of the game you want to play and what part of the game you dont want to play. Rules go for everyone. do you think you're the only alliance that plans to be active next era? Please understand that no-one is trying to hurt your alliance, we just want fair play for everyone.
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mjx1
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 Post Posted: Sat Jan 17, 2009 3:25 pm    Post subject:
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RedDwarf although only 2 members agree to this pact I would also like to add any other alliance I may lead in the future automatically agrees on founding and furthermore agreemen to this treaty will now become a condition for me on deciding to join a alliance in the future
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Failtrip1
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 Post Posted: Sat Jan 17, 2009 4:29 pm    Post subject:
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SpaceGamer wrote:
Failtrip1 wrote:
ToC agrees and gives its signature to it


So Toc you have agreed to not drop members until they evo out by destruction of IT.


I agree to follow the Spacetrace Rules.

At this time there is no rule that states you can not ban any member at anytime. It your flag was in jeopardy because a spy or two you would definitely want to be able to ban them.
I don't see how admin could enforce that banning rule.

I have to Agree with DragonLilly that I hate the flag capture game. I will still allow myself to be banned whenever needed. The flag capture game should be a choice like Score planets or the creature game or colony expansion. So all you out there who want our flag because you are too lazy to fight to make points I say so what.
Attack for real points. Win them.


Dominion does all the killing IT is only there to be killed.

Score planet is soemthing totally different than CTF.CGC went for all points ,to feast on dead accounts and forgot on other aspects of the game.When you noticed you could lose points with flag loss you went down to 2 members but at all time you should have your flag guarded with at least two full MP.
CTF IS attack for real points,fight for real,live battles and believe me when fighting for real points there is no way to earn easy points,to take big points from one who knows at least two things about ST.

You fight for real points,defend your score,earn it.Dont just take it from dead accounts.If its necessary play dirty,spy whatever just dont abuse game for what its not meant to be.I know it doesnt say anywhere in the rules but still have some balls and fight for it.

No matter big or small alliance all have to fear for their flag and thats what is only right.Attack for the flag is attack into hart of your motherland and if you wont protect your inland then you dont deserve those points you farmed accross galaxy.
You know the story of a fighter and brick.When he breaks 10 briicks with one punch and master comes along and say that brick doesnt strike back.Well CTF makes sure you get your brick that strikes back.
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admin
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 Post Posted: Sat Jan 17, 2009 5:09 pm    Post subject:
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if you agree or disagree to the pact, you should take part in the poll at:
http://www.spacetrace.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=6563
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colinthecorgi
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 Post Posted: Sat Jan 17, 2009 6:04 pm    Post subject:
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We in WFS are basically for the pact. We are considering details at the moment, but on general principle we agree. I will make a more solid confirmation after talking to our members. As drillsergeant pointed out, there is much to be considered, such as:
- Just getting rid of the high scorers of your alliance
- evoing several members regularly so that you always have a remote and probably unknown location to stash the flag
- creating new accounts that are only played once to send starter fleets at the target planet, then following up with real accounts that have HQ invaders etc. The minus scores for clearing a heavily guarded target are taken by the "one-shot" accounts, the rewards are reaped by the alliance.
-etc, etc
All these "low" tactics should be prohibited in the pact.


The main reason which is pro-CTF is this:

When you fly around a lot with your fleets, your base is open to attack, more or less. But in general it is better to attack then to defend, so this should pay off in the long run. BUT, the CTF thing adds a nice dimension, namely that you must think of defending your gains. That kind of activity is much more difficult, and adds flavor to actually holding a top score at the end of an era.

This is my personal view, but I know NS would agree considering the great action we created last era.
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T2
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 Post Posted: Sat Jan 17, 2009 6:30 pm    Post subject:

TPC will refrain from making any pact. ATM, it's just me despite the listing as 2 players. Under current rules, I cannot capture a flag or have my flag captured.
I like Darth's analogy that cannot just eat noobs, rack up a good score and not look after your house or worry about someone stealing 20% of your points.
I'll maintain if you use all your players to exert dominance over the Black Hole, you could lose your flag due to inattentiveness.

ATM you don't have to worry about me but if I see a flag station that's worth points, I'll grab it assuming I have 3 ppl in my alliance. If I drop to 2 players, the flag gets cashed in. Easy enough to follow ?

Same old rules I've always played under.

I will refrain from stealing a flag from an alliance that is at war with someone other than me. This concession I will make.

If I do not want my flag stolen, AND want to get to the top of the point race, I better be prepared to work extra hard cause I can oly do it with a 2 man alliance.
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